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‘Why should you die for a transfer?’

July 17, 2011
On July 18, two days after they killed him, police identified the teenager as Kenneth Harding, 19, and demonized him with a heap of allegations that led one reporter to ask police accountability advocate Mesha Irizarry, "Aren't you relieved the police killed such a vicious criminal?"
Sister Halimah Allah writes from Los Angeles on July 18: “As I watch another Black man – shot down in the street like a mad dog by occupation forces paid for by our tax dollars and 456 years of dehumanization – I read accounts of the incident and wonder: What is this young man’s name? Who are his people: family, friends etc.? Does he have a mother? Does she know her son is dead? (Peace be upon him.) I’m the mother of four Black men! I’m grandma to nine grandsons. I’m great-grandma to one. I’ve seen this scene too many times in my 70 years! I wonder: WHO WILL MOURN for this young Black Man? WHO WILL MOURN for all those yet to fall at the hands of our ever-open enemies? Who will mourn for us all?”

by Willie Ratcliff

When police stopped a teenager stepping off the T-train yesterday to show his transfer as proof he’d paid his fare – $2 at most – he ran from them. They shot him as many as 10 times in the back and neck, according to witnesses. For many long minutes, as a crowd watched in horror, the boy, who had fallen to the sidewalk a block away, lay in a quickly growing pool of blood writhing in pain and trying to lift himself up as the cops trained their guns on him and threatened bystanders.

Having killed the boy at 4:44 p.m., according to the San Francisco Chronicle, in broad daylight at the main intersection – Third Street between Palou and Oakdale – in Bayview Hunters Point, San Francisco’s last largely Black neighborhood, the police seemed eager to terrorize the community. They waited and waited and waited as the teenager stopped moving but continued breathing before eventually setting him on a gurney and taking him to the hospital, where the Chronicle reports he died at 7:01 p.m.

“Why should you die for a transfer?” asked a witness known as Tiptoe in the crowd of hundreds of residents that soon gathered in the plaza at the Oakdale/Palou light rail stop. “Justice will be brought!” hollered one man repeatedly in a booming voice as the crowd shouted at the long line of police in riot gear standing between them and the dying youngster. “I saw the riot squad fly by me on Palou yesterday – five trucks in all,” wrote Bayview resident Sherry Bryson on Facebook.

As usual following police murders, the San Francisco Police Department came up with an excuse. The Chronicle relayed it: “As the officers tried to detain the man, he took off running and drew a gun, police said,” according to staff writer Joe Garofoli. “When the suspect shot at the officers, they returned fire, fatally wounding him,” he continued, quoting SFPD Sgt. Michael Andraychak.

None of the many witnesses I spoke with yesterday saw the young victim either holding or shooting a gun and firmly believe he was unarmed. ABC7’s Carolyn Tyler balanced the police claim that they shot the youngster in self-defense by interviewing Trivon Dixon, who said: “He was running. How could he be a threat in retreat? And he wasn’t running backwards, turning around shooting. He was in full throttle, running away from the police. I don’t see in any way how he could be a threat to the police.”

On Sunday, KTVU.com reported an announcement by San Francisco Police Chief Greg Suhr that a gun had been found which he said belonged to the victim. That police have also kicked off the usual campaign to demonize the victim is evident in KTVU noting that “the suspect had an extensive criminal record out of state.” And in another standard response to a police murder, KTVU reported, “Police patrolled the Third Street corridor Sunday with an additional 10 officers due to an increase in gun violence in the past three weeks.”

“How come a Black man can get shot for not having a transfer? How come a Black man has to be so terrorized that he feels that he has to run for not having a transfer?” ponders activist and graduate student Malaika Kambon. “These kinds of killings have not, would not, do not ever happen in white communities anywhere in the world,” she notes in a Facebook discussion.

“This is insane! They are shooting people over transfers?” exclaimed Renaldo Ricketts on Facebook. “Over a transfer – a piece of paper? That is just so wrong!” wrote Sherry Bryson.

This frame from a video shot by a bystander shows the teenager struggling to lift himself out of a pool of his own blood as a San Francisco police officer – one of several – aims his gun at the boy rather than trying to save his life. – Video frame: TheOneNonly457
“Why did they have to chase him for a transfer?” wrote Latashia Burleson, who started the discussion. “There are many people on the bus who didn’t pay. What they gone do, chase everyone down? And they wonder why they don’t get no respect or cooperation in the community. This makes my blood boil. It has to stop!”

On June 29, Bayview- and Mission District-based POWER, heading a coalition of transit and civil right activist groups that recently helped secure 12,000 free passes for low-income youth passengers, staged a demonstration calling for free Muni – free transit passes for all passengers, the San Francisco Examiner reported. The San Francisco Municipal Railway, known as Muni, has followed up major rate increases in recent years with greatly intensified police fare enforcement, imposing heavy fines and even jail time for riders who are unable to prove by showing a paper transfer that they paid their fare.

“Let’s all remember that we are second class citizens to the police. Period,” remarked Robert Pineda.

As night fell, firefighters washed the teenager's blood off the sidewalk and police and reporters talked. Rick Hauptman, who posted this photo on Facebook, noted: "The police seemed almost jolly. I saw many handshakes among them; I couldn't figure that out. Were they solely being respectful to their colleagues and to senior officers, or was it something else?”
“We have a Mafioso-type situation in San Francisco,” wrote Alan Collins, “where the police make endorsements of so-called ‘moderate’ political candidates and those candidates very often win election and you almost never hear anything from them that amounts to criticism, let alone any type of serious investigation, of the police. This has made SF a city with police who are simply unaccountable, can be assured of getting away with virtually anything, and a collection of elected officials who know that if they do anything that counters what the police want, they will be treated the way Rupert Murdoch has operated with his media empire: reward and punishment.”

“As the state has removed any illusion that it exists to serve or protect people, we can see clearly that it exists only to push us into prisons and to shoot us in cold blood. Two single dollars are worth more to them than our lives. The very existence of the police clearly endangers all of us,” concluded an anonymous writer on Indybay.

A comment on YouTube under the video, “SFPD Ruthlessly Shoots and Kills Unarmed 19yr old Man over $2 Bus Fair,” posted above, reflects the common wisdom in the community that this was a public execution with a purpose: “The white man did the same thing during slavery. They would take a Black man and whip him or kill him in front of all the slaves, to make sure the slaves got the picture of who’s in control.”

A press conference and speakout has been called for Monday noon at Third and Oakdale by the Idriss Stelley Foundation, Education Not Incarceration, the San Francisco Bay View newspaper and Poor Magazine. According to Indymedia, a protest will begin at 5 p.m. Tuesday in Dolores Park.

Bay View publisher Willie Ratcliff can be reached at publisher@sfbayview.com or (415) 671-0789.

 

275 thoughts on “‘Why should you die for a transfer?’

  1. Jarvar

    As long as the holice can punk a crowd of black men and women as they murder one us this will become even more common.

    Reply
  2. LaShonda

    Yo where is that Malvo guy when you need him?!?! I want to see cops pay they are so sick in the head! Get those psychos with guns and badges off our streets!

    Reply
  3. Michael Guilford

    This just isn't right. Have the police come up with some lame ass rationale as to why it was necessary to execute this young man on the street? Damn if I wouldn't join y'all in ripping up the town after this shit.

    Reply
    1. Seamus

      To answer your question: The article states the police fired after being fired upon. You should read the article and others before going out into the street breaking things. The man's name is Kenneth Harding (19). He's wanted for murder in Washington state.

      People here don't want to know that though.

      Reply
      1. Denmark Vesey

        seamus, you're as much of a moron as the pigs who murdered Kenneth Harding. Harding was NOT wanted for murder and there were no shots fired by him. The pigs are lying.

        Reply
        1. Seamus

          There is nothing in my post that is untrue. You label me a moron without indicating why. Harding is wanted by the Seattle Police homicide detectives for the murder of Tanaya Gilbert. The police report Harding shot at them.

          You should be able to see beyond what you want to be true or you're no better than some delusional Republican who refuses to accept there was no WMD.

          Reply
      2. Lance Worth

        what happened to "innocent until proven guilty?" if he stands accused of murder then he should go to trial. This does NOT justify unrelated police shooting him for an unrelated incident.

        Reply
        1. Seamus

          I never said Harding was guilty of murder. I said the police in Seattle want Harding in the murder of Gilbert. Please read the words, don't read into them. He was chased for a ticket & apparently shot at police, which is why they shot back.

          Who said he was guilty and who said he was shot for the Seattle stuff. The police didn't discover he was wanted for murder until after he was dead.

          Good grief.

          Reply
    2. You White Homo

      Oh Michael, you homo. You seem interested in this black boy …. kind of like Jeffrey Dahmer.

      Reply
  4. jeco

    This is the same kid however who is wanted for killing a pregnant woman in WA. I don't condone what the police did, however this wasn't an innocent kid either.

    Reply
    1. jeco

      Older article but: http://www.komonews.com/news/local/125548788.html

      Hate to see anyone killed but someone on the run after doing something like this was not an innocent victim who was killed over a transfer. He thought the police were onto him for MURDER so he fled. Did he have a gun? Hopefully we'll find out or not for sure and this incident is closely examined, but again, he wasn't fleeing because he didn't have a transfer, he was fleeing because he's a wanted murderer. I think it's irresponsible journalism to make it out like he was just a poor innocent black kid gunned down because he couldn't afford a transfer. There's way more to this story.

      Reply
      1. Selina

        How Do You know ???when there's no detailed description in this article
        that matches the description in article of the news link on your post

        The article Komonews just says an armed black man 6'1 stocky build
        here in this article the description just says teenager with "out of town" priors????

        Reply
        1. jeco

          I know because this dumb ass has been all over the news here and it was in our local media before it hit there that this was the same guy.

          Reply
        2. seamus

          He read real news articles. That's how he knows. Do a Google news search and you will find articles on the incident.

          Reply
          1. Selina

            I also read and the article from Mercury News says

            "Harding was a person of interest in last Wednesday's shooting death of Tanaya Gilbert, 19, in South Seattle, Sainez said. Family members said Gilbert was several weeks pregnant. Three other people were also injured in that shooting.

            Seattle police Det. Mark Jamieson told The Associated Press he could not confirm that Harding was linked to those shootings. " THE DATE OF THE ARTICLE July 18 2011
            ***************
            This article is from a GOOGLE Search and Mercury News has features "REAL News"

    2. Doc O

      So the cop recognized him, was certain of his ID, Reviewed his case, convicted him, sentenced him and carried out his sentence and all in the blink of an eye. Wow.

      Reply
      1. jeco

        I don't know what exactly happened and if you weren't there you don't either. Why do you automatically assume he DIDN'T have a gun?

        Reply
        1. anon

          Because everyone not a cop says that he didn't have a gun…there is also no gun in the video. The vid does show cops letting a kid bleed to death while harassing people videoing it with their phones.

          Reply
          1. anonymous

            I ended up posting here, as I am not sure how to post to everyone. I agree that this kid was wanted in suspicion of other crimes, very well could have been him. the point that bothers me is that a) they didn't know who he was when they shot him to death b) even if he did have a gun, did they have to KILL him as he ran away. What ever happened to the concept of slowing down a so-called criminal (not saying he is innocent. I don't know that part) but what is so horrid about shooting his leg so he can't run, if he had a gun, of course. 10 bullets in the back is not an excuse for anything short of twenty men running at cops with shotguns. I don't know.

            I don't live in the Bay anymore, but it is reminiscent of the young man shot to death at Bart on New Years Eve…Oscar Grant……..

      2. ron austin

        Nope. The cop just noticed Mr. Harding fire a gun at him, so he did not have time to request ID, arrest him, bring him to trial, etc. I'm glad all of you down in "da hood" have the time to do all the appropriate measures when being fired at. Guess this cop just didn't have the time to do all of that. So much for Mr. Harding. Who cares?

        Reply
    3. Anna

      I agree! There is no need to run from the police because of not having a transfer either. They just give you a ticket. This incident should not be connected with Oscar grant killing on Bart either. It's two different cases. If anything, Oscar Grant's best friend Johntue Caldwell being shot randomly in Hayward should last friday should have more connection with Oscar Grant's killing.

      Reply
  5. truth

    In lower crime communities, you would not see police evasion, much less over a $2 fare. This kid did not want to be detained for his murder history. Also, not all "white communities" are crime free. They don't coin the phrase white trash for nothing.

    Reply
    1. ENOUGH

      Don't come here with with that crap… you should not be detained for fare evasion, you just get a ticket, but with young black men, it may be treated like a felony. The police did not know who he was. SHOT IN THE BACK AND NECK. That is not going to fly.

      Reply
      1. KSom

        When you recieve a ticket, they run your id for any possible warrants or previous arrests, thats probably why he ran because he knew he would get arrested, however, there is no excuse for the police shooting him, unless he is did in fact have a gun. Which is still unclear at this point.

        Reply
      2. dummy

        Hey wasn't going to be detained until he started running away. Just take the t100 ticket and not pay…could he be running for some other reason? Like a criminal past?

        Reply
  6. ENOUGH

    I am so sick of this…we all know the Bayview is the last black neighborhood in the city….is this the first stages of ethnic cleansing? The continued gentrification of the Bayview….hell, the got the Fillmore, we know what the Bayview is worth…and we know, to them, we are worth nothing…this can not stand….

    Reply
  7. dick

    Nice false reporting here… This wasn't a "boy", he was a 19-year old convicted parolee wanted in connection with a murder in Seattle who first shot at the cops.

    Don't let the truth get in the way of your narrative, though. Al Sharpton would be proud!!!

    Reply
    1. Tammy S

      I agree. There may be facts that the writer was not aware of and because of that the writer should refrain from being biased in any way. I certainly believe that black people are, unfortunately, still not treated equally in society.

      It's disgusting and sad. I see it every day in "main-stream" media and their obvious failures at reporting unbiased facts, in hopes of assisting you in forming their opinion. Which completely adds to the ignorance that people have when they say this doesn't happen! But IGNORANCE is fueled by fear and anger, no matter what side your on.

      If you are a dedicated and responsible journalist, then you won't need to lead your reader. The facts will speak for themselves.

      I believe that we need more articles about this subject, but the article should be void of any opinionated statements of the writer. That's hard to do when you are passionate about whats wrong with world, but it's the right and responsible thing to do.

      More facts… The best journalists avoid rushing to judgement. They focus on quickly looking for FACTS, then double checking those facts, and speaking to witnesses with FIRST hand knowledge. BUT DEFINITELY KEEP THIS SUBJECT IN THE LIGHT~ THAT'S HOW YOU CHANGE THINGS

      Reply
    2. Baby Shower ideas

      I don't know the actual info.To writer please give actual information. It will be helpful for everybody. Its may happen to your ignorance, please get information again. To saw this comment i am too much confused.

      Reply
  8. jeco

    Some people claim he didn't have a gun, some claim he did. If he's found to have actually had a gun and shot at the police, are you still going to complain that he was just a victim?
    He also just got out of jail for a sex offense. This kind of stuff irritates the crap out of me because people are ready to assume that he was a victim automatically and when a TRUE innocent person actually gets profiled and abused by the police people doubt it precisely because of situations like this. Save all the anger for the people who are actually abused and profiled by the police, of whom there are many, not wanted murderers who try to shoot cops.

    Reply
    1. korts

      "Some people claim he didn't have a gun, some claim he did"–yes, the people who shot him claim he had a gun; everyone else who saw the incident clearly says he didn't. It's not really clear why you would believe the perpetrators instead of the witnesses.

      Reply
      1. jeco

        The reason i believe the "perpetrators" is because I live in the PNW and am aware of all the stuff this punk did to people (i.e. other BLACK PEOPLE) before he fled to SF to hide out for all the crap he's done here. He had a gun when he was here so I'm sure he had a gun there. If this was truly a poor kid who was scared over not having a transfer I'd be enraged and right there with you. But this was a punk who prostituted a kid out and shot and killed a pregnant woman.

        Reply
    2. tired of this shit

      And whrn its foumd that he didn't have a gun, are you still going to complain that he deserved it

      Reply
    3. Jacob Jones

      Here's the problem with your rationale.. The police had no clue he was wanted for murder, yet they still shot the man down over a $2 transfer.. That's the problem, here, that the police are way too eager to use deadly force, for anything, and everything.. Nevermind the fact that they… Pardon the southern expression… Schitt in a swinging jug.. lol..

      Reply
  9. results

    Don't run from the popo because you don't have a transfer unless it is to another state called Washington than you run with gun and die with one

    Reply
  10. Z

    You can never escape from your own shadow. Looks like that teen’s bad karma finally caught up with him & the cops just accumulated some of their own, which will bite them in the ass one of these days. Shooting someone in the back is pretty damn shameful, especially if the teen wasn’t really armed at all. Aren’t there painless/minimally harmful tranquilizers that cops can use instead of bullets??

    Reply
  11. Patrick

    I guess "dick" believe anything the authorities and people who are in power say. There was no gun recovered at the scene of the crime and it was only discovered after the shooting this person was wanted for QUESTIONING in the death of someone in Washington. No proof or conviction was made, they're simply trying to drag his reputation through the mud to justify the departments action. And since when did being a parole justify murder?

    All of the witnesses have conflicting stories to that of the police department. Knowing we live in a police state, how the hell are you going to take their word over those who watched this maddening event take place?

    Reply
    1. dick

      Patrick– PAY ATTENTION. This guy HAD A GUN, SHOT AT THE COPS, and they RETURNED FIRE. I'm glad they took this mental midget off the streets and saved us all the cost of a trial. His death has made the world a better place.

      Reply
      1. anonymous

        So why does everyone not in a uniform say that he did not have a gun? And why does the video not show a gun? Where are the bullet holes? they must have hit something right? Was their powder on his fingers? Do the bullet holes match the gun? Did the gun happen to be one that was previously recovered by police?

        You are probably just a racist.

        Reply
          1. Dick Knife

            Uh, dick, I mean Yellowknife: the poppimple510 video above is a doctored video. This has been proven here: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=101503226… and here in this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmT4lG_tYK8.

            In the video above:

            It has NOT been established that he opened fire or even had a gun. ALL witnesses say he didn't have a gun. Police are now saying that they don't have the alleged gun after all. If u look here from 0:36-0:45&then from 2:15-2:38, u see police scanning w/a clear view of the area that the gun was SUPPOSEDLY in. THIS vid happens minutes b4 the other vid. ALSO@1:58,u see a plain clothes cop going over the chain to the area they say the gun was in. IF THERE WAS A GUN, HE'D HAVE PICKED IT UP!

  12. gene

    he had a gun, you morons, and shot at the police. police have shown racial profiling but this isnt the case. its just the media blowing this out of proportions and people ready to bitch about anything

    Reply
    1. srsly

      every non-police witness confirms that he didn't have a gun and couldn't have been shooting. why do you think otherwise, did you see it happen?

      Reply
      1. PTSD

        If you watch one of these videos it is clear that there is a silver gun on the ground at the scene. But it was a good distance from the victim, as well as his cell phone…

        But the point still remains that no witness saw him fire, only the police who shot him did, which seems strange. Just because he was "a person of interest", on parole, etc. is no excuse for letting police be judge, jury, and executioner.

        Reply
        1. anonymous

          I agree too. Even if he was GUILTY for murder, running cause he had no transfer and guity of murder doesn't mean you shoot him 10 times in the back. There is no excuse, guilty or not. They don't need to KILL someone to detail them for questioning. They are just using that BS to cover their butts, and I am sure they are lucky it is there. Then people can say, "oh, he was a convicted murdered. Doesn't matter". Well, maybe he was, the cops reaction to this was not reasonable. Period. You don't shoot someone to death for being a suspect, or even having a gun. Sorry…then shoot them in the back. Ridiculous. I guess they will never know if he was innocent or guilty of the other crimes.

          Reply
    2. Wayne

      You might consider looking in the mirror the next time you think of accusing others of being 'morons,' dude or would that be dudette in your case, hate-monger? And right, what makes you so certain? Were you there? Nah, racists need not be present, do they, when they have SF gestapo to do there murders for them, right pal?

      Reply
  13. Mellie

    Regardless of there being a gun "maybe" involved or not, any human being who has been shot and is now lying in a pool of his own blood and unable to stand, is quite obviously, and should no longer be considered a "threat."
    Last I checked, the police are not legal enforcers of corporal nor capitol punishment. The issue of this person's innocence or guilt is irrelevant because this incident has resulted in a blatant murder which was committed by those who are entrusted to be civil servants, and who are *not* given the authority to act as the gestapo.

    Reply
    1. ron austin

      Well, go get the job of police officer in that neighborhood and when you see someone laying face down who "maybe" has a gun, walk over to them, turn them over and have a polite conversation with them about "capitol" punishment. Maybe chat with some people in the crowd to get their opinion. Seemed like a nice safe, rational bunch. Until then, GOOD JOB SFPD.

      Reply
        1. Ralph

          What? Having your gun drawn in this situation is so legal I can't believe you would even say that. Sorry, no one with half a brain walks up to the kid who was just willing to kill them. If that's what you want from cops, you're going to find yourself in a world without policemen. But then I guess you'd start complaining about how the government never stops crime…

          Reply
          1. natalie213

            Murder is not legal. That was clearly murder under color of law. Sickening that anyone defends it. It is the worst kind of crime in the world. No one is safe as long as this is allowed to continue.

      1. ENOUGH

        "IN THAT NEIGHBORHOOD"……you just said a mouthful. You just summed up the feeling of the police/overseers toward the community.

        Reply
        1. anonymous

          I agree with you Natalie. Murder is murder no matter how you want to spin it. Cops are trained in how to disable an arm if someone has a gun so that they don't have to kill people to capture them. with all of the cops there, you think any of them could have shot his arm with the so called gun…

          Reply
          1. anonymous

            Cops aren't snipers. They can't pick out a body part to shoot. They're trained to hit center mass which is the biggest target of the body.

  14. Skatmanfu

    Man… Seems like there's shootings every couple weeks in this neighborhood.

    Pretty sure it will eventually turn out proven that this kid did in fact shoot at the police and was involved in the shooting up in S. Seattle. Even still…Kind of hard to be pointing at the police for shooting first and asking questions later in this 'hood.

    Some of y'all black folk need to stop blaming everybody else and start looking in the mirror as to why you have this shit happening in your community so much.

    Reply
      1. MiamiBro

        Would you say that if the young man who was shot was alleged to have murdered your pregnant sister?

        Reply
    1. The Spirit

      Is the reason he lay there for over 2:45 seconds, drowning in his own blood while two "officers" kept their weapons trained on him, because he was a threat to their safety? It was a cold-blooded assassination. It happens quite frequently in some communities. Where was their humanity? After being shot, at least, 10 times, struggling to get up, all he got was weapons pointed at him, as if ready to inflict another 10 gunshot wounds. WWJD? Such hypocrasy! Is this old Amerikkka?

      Reply
  15. duh

    Patriot Act, Bush Administration….it really doesn't matter.

    We have put the kids that got beat up in high school and the ones that didn't have the brains to come up with a better career than jumping in front of bullets for $60K a year in charge of our safety.

    These guys got treated like crap and now they are taking it out on us. Power trips. Lack of training. Lack of brain cells. Lack of vertical growth in their nether-regions.

    I will support the movement to remove "BART" police from their duties. This is far to far out of hand and since several have died already it time to handle it now. Not after the 6th and 7th death.

    By the way…what happened to the officer dropping the "F-Bomb"? IMO, thats a no-no enough to have that entire force pulled off of operation and re-evaluate our need for "rent a cops" with guns.

    Call your mayors office directly. Starting at 9am tomorrow.

    Reply
  16. torasap

    The pro-shooting comments here are shocking. This is the America we live in today… A place where statist apologists appear of their own volition to vilify the VICTIM of a brutal crime, ‘cuz the police NEVER make mistakes!

    Reply
  17. Realist1

    All of you going on and on about racial this and that are complete morons. If you run from the police, regardless of the situation, you deserve what you get. How many tail light violations result in finding much more severe criminals for crimes not necessarily apparent when pulled over?

    Same can be said for anyone stopped on the street. What happens on the highway if you hit the gas when the cops are trying to pull you over? Guess what, they will get you to stop no matter what (up to and including killing you) so running on the street should be no different.

    If anything, cops need more rights out there. Look at the scum sitting in our jails that do nothing but repeatedly offend for the same crimes again and again. These people deserve a bullet as well, we can't afford to have anything in this state but we are feeding and clothing wastes of society.

    Long story short? Good riddance. Wrong doings have consequences and THATS what people need to open there eyes to.

    Reply
    1. Alyssa

      What if this was your son? When we make our judgements as though each victim/perpetrator/police were our own son or daughter, we see with clearer eyes.

      Reply
      1. Realist1

        If it were my son, and he ran from the police, while I may be upset it doesn't change the fact that he had done something wrong and got what i feel was deserved.

        Reply
        1. Justin

          So if your son ran when they would ask for his transfer papers, you would really think that he got what he deserved? Really? I remember when I was around 16-17 I often made jokes where I would run from the guys checking the tickets on the bus, even though I HAD a ticket, only because back then I thought it was funny. So I deserved a bullet, for you this constitutes a crime, right?
          Then what do actual criminals deserve? The ones who kill, rape or steal?
          I guess you would shoot children for stepping on your lawn.
          You really have some problems, man.

          Reply
    2. thoughtful citizen

      So anyone who breaks the law deserves to be shot? We should execute everyone in prison? Really think about what you are saying. Regardless of your sense of justice, you have to realize how ridiculous that statement is.

      Reply
      1. Realist1

        If you read what I had written, you'd see that I was referring specifically to repeat criminals that do not learn their lesson the first time. Rape someone, go to jail, get off on good behavior, back on the streets and rape another person. Go to jail again? Not in my world. Those are the people that need to be dragged out back and shot, in the back if need be. Why keep them here if they are persistently breaking the law without care of the legal repercussions?

        Watch some of those "lockdown" shows and you can see it first hand. Idiots that do nothing but fight or collaborate against prison guards after being imprisoned over the most petty things. Not self defense because of some type of gang environment, but out looking to get in to fights to prove who is "toughest" or who's the "better man". Guess what, the "better man" is the one laughing at them watching from home.

        Reply
        1. Sean Laney

          "Rape someone, go to jail, get off on good behavior, back on the streets and rape another person."

          If you actually had evidence of this happening, it would strengthen your case. Of course, it is obvious to anyone who has even a modicum of knowledge about the justice system in this state that you don't have the slightest clue what you are talking about. You are nothing but a scared, bitter person. I pity you.

          "Watch some of those 'lockdown' shows and you can see it first hand"

          You probably think that Survivor was an accurate depiction of people trying to survive on an island, too.

          Reply
  18. MiamiBro

    There will literally be dozens of killings of black people by black people in the coming days all over the country and over the city. We will probably not react as harshly. Here's a question: Let's say that the young man that was shot was white but he was also wanted for killing a pregnant black woman in Seattle. Yep, say he was a person of interest. Would we still be calling the cops pigs? I'm gonna go ahead and say no. We are our greatest enemies by far today. No one is doing a more effective job of shooting down young black people today than….And as we are reacting let's pause for a moment and think of the hundreds of bodies that dropped that got no press because it was black folk killing black folk. No one will respect you if you don't respect yourself. Same goes for a people.

    Reply
    1. rbg

      Of course we would still be calling them pigs, because that is what they are. This notion that black people are killing more black people than white people is silly. The fact is, white people kill more white people and non white people than any other people on the planet.

      Reply
      1. MiamiBro

        Your statement is paralyzed by rhetoric but let's go through it. So to be clear, if the young, pregnant black woman that was killed was your wife or sister, you wouldn't call the pigs would you? Ok. What would you do if you found the person who you thought that the person who did this was in front of you? Maybe you would sit down for tea. (After that is how disputes are being settled in the low income black community. (That's why the murder rate is so low there. Right??) Finally, how would you reply to a Tutsi woman who was gang raped by Hutus and watched her children killed by Hutus when she looks at you like a damn fool for saying that. Better yet, why don't you go say that in Seattle to Tanaya's people? (They shootin at the funerals over there though)
        We must no longer comfort ourselves with saying things because they make us feel good. We must seek strategies that improve our condition. "I'm not here to say what you'd like to hear" Malcolm X

        Reply
    2. Sean Laney

      "Would we still be calling the cops pigs? I'm gonna go ahead and say no."

      I would. Those cops had no way of knowing any of that information at the time, so it is irrelevant in determining the validity of the shooting.

      My beef has nothing to do with any of that. I saw a helpless person bleeding out on the street, and a bunch of cops standing around waving guns instead of rendering emergency aid to stop bleeding. I am seeing more and more of this "let him bleed out" attitude in these police shooting videos. We know a lot of cops are cross-trained as EMTs — why are they letting him bleed out instead of giving him medical attention?

      Reply
    1. wwjd

      how do you know? did you see it? because everyone else who saw it, except for the cops, says he didn't. but you're psychic?

      Reply
      1. PTSD

        Agreed, witness' say he didn't shoot. That seems pretty straight forward, unless all of them are lying because…? Shot 10 times folks – what I want to see is if the coroner examinations shows every one of the bullet wounds to have been from behind… as he was sprinting away. Why would you need to shoot someone 10 times, and then delay getting them help? To make sure they don't talk.

        I also would like to know if the police shooters have been in military service, in war, and if they are unstable.

        Reply
  19. koldobika2020

    All of you reactionary morons need to step back and look at it objectively for a moment and do you research. This kid DID have a gun, multiple corroborating witnesses reported that it was taken by another witness after the kid fell. Police recovered the weapon thanks to tips. He was also wanted in Washington for KILLING A PREGNANT GIRL as well as SEX OFFENSES. This was not a "good kid" who was running away over a transfer. This was a career criminal with a gun. You should be thanking your gods that he is off the streets and can no longer kill pregnant women.

    Reply
    1. natalie213

      This kid was on the streets at 19 years old, so I doubt whatever offense he was previously convicted for was very serious, but even if it was, is killing the answer? Murder under color of law is still murder.

      Reply
    2. PTSD

      Yes he had a gun, and was a suspect in Washington. Yes, none of the witness' say he shot at police.

      Did the police know his record when they shot him 10 times in the back? You koldobika2020 are a victim too – of news media – all of these facts are coming out post-killing to help people feel like it was justified. Letting police get away with this is a dangerous road that allows them to kill first and figure out how to justify later.

      Reply
  20. Common Sense

    So the Police shot the victim that was ALLEGEDLY shooting at them, surrounded him with guns as he took is last breaths, but didn't think to secure the weapon ? Really, you want me to believe that.

    Reply
    1. ENOUGH

      That's right….they would let the suspects gun just lay on the ground without protecting it? Bull Sh*t….and you need an AK47 for a fare evasion.

      Reply
    2. Mike

      Uh, he could have easily dropped the gun or handed it off to someone else. But no, you're right, you know everything that happened because a website on the internet showed a video of him dying.

      Reply
      1. PTSD

        Look at some recent videos, the gun is silver on the ground beyond the dying 19 year old. Doesn't mean he was shooting it though.

        Reply
  21. JimmyCrackCorns

    They should have thrown rocks at the police, rioted, and let the city know the people are tired of being shaken down by over armed, juiced up goon squads with badges and guns. WTF was that cop doing with an assault rifle out????!!!!

    Reply
    1. Crackerdevilman

      Rioting has a long histoy of fixing social injustices. The Watts riots transformed a poor neighborhood into a thriving suburb. Oh and don't forget Compton after the Rodney King injustice. After a week of destroying buildings, beatings, shootings and other assorted mayhem turned a once gang infested hell hole into the envy of LA. Oh wait… that didn't happen.

      Reply
      1. Crackerdevilman

        Here's an anology: Your rich neighbor kills your dog because he thought it was going to bite his child. You're upset at him, so you punch your wife about the face, throw your money in a sewer, and set your house on fire. Then when your other neighbors come to see what the comotion is about, you point at your rich neighbor and yell, "Look what he made me do! I'm the victim." Your neighbors lament the death of your dog, but that quickly fades as they go back about the daily tasks of living. Meanwhile your rich neighbor, unscathed save for a few admonishments, goes back into his nice house, bangs his hot wife, plays with his kids, and counts his money while you sit in the ashes of your former worldy possessions and wonder why people just don't give a shit. But by all means riot, burn Bayview to the ground. It just saves the man the cost of demolition before gentrification.

        Reply
  22. Mellie

    Whether or not we believe our penile system is serving the best interests of the public, (it quite obviously is not,) or whether you have a personal belief that is in favor of capitol punishment, (which is fine, and not the issue here,) it is important to realize that there is a tremendous risk that the assumption of "he got what he deserved" makes, in regards to our civil liberties.
    When the police are no acting as agents of the law, where their "job" is to *detain* suspects, even those thought and/or known to be violent criminals, so that they may then be subject to due process, then we no longer have civil servants as a police force, we no longer are living in a democracy, we are subjecting ourselves to totalitarianism, and we are practically begging for the instigation of Martial Law to fall upon us. The reason why the rights of criminals is important, is because they are *your rights too.* If you fail to make that distinction, so will "they." And your innocence or guilt will no longer be subject to scrutiny in the eyes of the "law," they can and will execute their instruments of power upon you, by force if necessary, and be damned the consequences because there is no law, no government, and no public, (that being us/you,) to hold them accountable to their actions.

    Reply
    1. harrassee

      You are wrong. You watch too much TV. The police's job is to remove threats. If someone starts shooting the gun in public, their job is to REMOVE THE THREAT (whether to the cops or bystanders) immediately. That means unloading the pistol into the chest, make sure that perp does not fire another shot. The cops are not required to aim for the legs, disarm, or "wing" the perp to detain them – few are that good with a gun (and most cops rarely, if ever, fire their pistol in the line of duty). The perp chose a shoot out when he fired the gun, and that is how he fell.

      Police are not your mommy, they are hear to protect you from others, not your self.. If you are the threat, you will be removed, as efficiently and quickly as possible. My advice, don't shoot at police.

      Reply
  23. Muk

    Typical black crowd trying to make the cops look bad, this guy was NOT UNARMED if you search the other amateur videos you will see one of the crowd picking up a firearm and running off with it. Black people do it all the time, just to interfere with an investigation and then hold demonstrations afterwards calling it a unjustified. Here these officers are trying to reduce crime and homicides in the neighborhood and the author who wrote this article demonizes them. Someone innocent could have gotten killed. I hate how everytime a black person gets killed by the police the whole african american community goes in uproar because they think it was racist even when it's blatantly obvious who was in the wrong. If you fire at the police…the police WILL FIRE BACK, it don't fucking matter whether you're a man or a woman, black, white, asian or latino.

    Reply
      1. rez

        his comment was not racist at all, your ignorance is fucking nauseating.
        I am tired of all you dumbass black people making me look bad,
        always trying to fight authority for the sake of fighting authority.
        fucking disgrace.

        Reply
        1. natalie213

          You're really not smart at all. "He says, "Typical black crowd…" how is that not racist? What is a "typical black crowd"? There were many lynching parties of all white folks, but it would sound ridiculous for me to say a "typical white crowd." I'm sorry you don't know what racism is. Back to school.

          Reply
  24. Mike

    I can't believe the piece of shit who wrote this article. Here these cops are trying to make the neighborhoods a safer place for everybody and you write an article snubbing them. This guy was NOT unarmed, someone in the crowd picked up the firearm and then ran off with it, it even shows in one of the videos. He discharged his firearm at police officers with absolute disregard for others around him and you write an article antagonizing the cops all while complaining that our neighborhoods aren't safe enough? you're a fucking schmuck willie ratcliff

    Reply
      1. Leroy Mashprince

        dueces natalie213 real talk, mah brothers n sistrs gootta recognize, they "pigs" iz looking out 4 u, unless ur one the rapist murderer gangbangin drug dealers, in which case go head an hate but u knew the game b4 u gamed truth!

        Reply
  25. Truth

    Sourced from Reddit:

    "I'm not normally one to rush to defend police, but this 'kid' DID have a gun that was removed by a witness before the police showed up. The police got the gun back after other witnesses tipped them off. There is video of this guy with his gun and he was also wanted in Washington for killing a pregnant girl. Oh yes, the kid had recently been released from a prison in Washington after serving time for convictions stemming from a King County sex offense.
    http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/

    Reply
    1. PTSD

      So, when you are wanted/suspect in crimes, and you have a gun on you, then it is ok for police to shoot you 10 times in the back as you run away from them? They can be judge and executioner? Don't let the media fool you, I doubt these cops knew who this guy was when they whot him, but were glad to find out that he had a record afterwards.

      Reply
    2. Guest

      WRONG. Factually, wrong. The police had been on scene for many minutes, pointing their guns at a dying man, before somebody picked up a gun (allegedly – it happens off camera, if it happened at all). Again, whatever he was guilty of, the police had no foreknowledge that would justify them becoming Jury, Judge and Executioner. He was, at that moment, just a running Black Man.

      Reply
  26. Vito Tums

    I hope someone checks the forensics report for the presence of gunpowder residue on his hands. If this isn't present then there is no way he could have fired a gun.

    Reply
  27. Malkkkom X

    The attitudes of this writer and all other police haters in the black community are big part of the reason why blacks are at the bottom of the totem pole. Please do riot and burn down as many buildings in your ghetto as you like. The white and Asian owners will collect their insurance and sell the land for condos that you can not afford. Blacks will remain reviled and despised by all other races.
    Maybe some day in the distant future the black race will evolve and their average IQ will rise above the imbecile level. Until then keep blaming whitey and the police dept. for your baboonesque behavior.
    Rattle the bars on your cages and we will throw you some peanuts if we are in a generous mood.

    Reply
    1. Selina

      It will be a blessed day when all you CAVE Dwelling Troglodykes

      are exterminated from the earth by your initiated wars in Afghanistan, Iraq and Libya

      My Coroprate Amerikkka instruct all of Apalachia from WV, Ak any where else in America
      to be placed in combat areas of the world where you'll be annihilated

      Reply
      1. Huh?

        The word is TROGLODYTE. If you're going to use big words in an attempt to make yourself appear smarter try to spell them right (or even close to right). As for the rest of your rant…what the hell are you talking about? You might as well just write LOUD NOISES!

        Reply
  28. Renaldo Ricketts

    I just watched the tape they were stalling for time waiting for him to die! He was on the ground covered in a POOL of blood,he posed no threat to them, it was the tactical let him bleed to death police maneuver, stall instead of emergency medical attention. Reminiscent of Oscar Grant on the Bart platform, they purposely delayed emergency medical attention knowing the victim didn't pose a threat to them.

    Reply
  29. Renaldo Ricketts

    These are orchestrated police tactics to guarantee a death. The video tape speaks volumes ,look at the time elapse to he time any "real" help arrived .This is a travesty after the shooting,the police go into slow motion nonchalant care for the victim knowing well he doesn't pose a threat. The sick psychology of vigilante policemen on steroid the title of my next book.

    Reply
    1. saywhat

      What should the police do turn their backs on an angry mob yelling "Fuck the police!" Maybe if the community had complied with police, the officers could have given some first aid.

      Reply
      1. sar

        How do you even know when the police called the ambulance. Yes it looks cruel with him on the ground, but he had a gun and everyone is screaming at the cops.

        Reply
  30. Renaldo Ricketts

    They didn't want him to live and tell the truth ! They knew when they saw him gasping for air it was his final moments,his body was riddled with bullets from the vigilante cops ! They went into let him bleed to death mode. The scenes in the …video of the deliberately moving slowly towards the victim is part of the act,as if he was going to spring to his feet and open fire.The big lie has to be told the fabricated scenario to fortify their lies has been rehearsed. CPR in this case means Con- cockted Police Response- a stall tactic in slow motion hoping the victim dies. This was so deliberate a blind man could see it and paint it in colors!
    -the video tape alone could be the subject of a class action lawsuit. Look at the elapse time ,the vigilante cops still acting like he was a threat ,I've not seen so much bullchit acting since John Wayne won an academy award.

    Reply
    1. James

      You sir, and I use sir loosely, are an idiot. How the hell can you have a class action lawsuit when only 1 person was affected by this shooting? I hope to god you don't have kids, but I'm sure you have 8 kids with 8 different women. If you knew anything, I'm sure the cops were worried about their safety having a crowd of about 50people around chanting fuck the police and getting in there face. The crowd gathering around acting aggressively is why they weren't administering any care on the guy. It looked to me like the ambulance got there pretty quick too.

      Reply
  31. Renaldo Manuel Ricketts

    The world is being exposed as to how this society’s vigilantes deal with African Americans, they are hand cuffed and shot in the back and white jurors see nothing wrong. I bet if any of those white jurors had a son in the same position hey… would not have taken that stand.They saw Rodney King beaten like a runaway slave by a swarm of white cops and saw nothing wrong .There is serious racial divide in this country and sometimes it implodes. keeping fooling your self and pretending the laws passed made anything equal,we have a segregated society that’s unattractively race base. You could deny it , but so what.the reality of the division is remains.

    Reply
    1. Alex

      @Erik: Do you think his firearm was registered to his name? Do you think he went through the precess and the REQUiREMENTS like taking a firearm course and passing a written/hands-on test oh and HAVE A CLEAN RECORD to be qualified to carry a firearm?… PS: Dont procreate.

      Reply
    2. TIredOftheBS

      He was a parolee and a resident of another state, there is no chance that he had a permit to carry anywhere in the state of California, let alone San Francisco, a city with some of the strictest gun control laws.

      Reply
    3. Harry

      The need for registration, etc is a law so that you can be traced to the use of a firearm. This will work both for you and against you as our militaristic country holds guns to innocent people in protest.

      Reply
  32. Ronald

    He had a gun…
    http://sfist.com/2011/07/17/demonstrators_protest

    And he was wanted in connection with the killing of a 19yr old pregnant woman. Without video of the shooting, there is no way to know if SFPD could have apprehended him without killing him. That being said, given the way the crowd reacted, and having a gun stuck in my face 3 times in 4 years within a block of where the shooting happened mostly for just being a skinny white kid, I wouldn't take any fucking chances either.

    Don't want nervous trigger happy cops? ACT MORE CIVIL IN YOUR NEIGHBORHOOD AND TOWARD THOSE OF US PASSING THROUGH. Cops fear for their lives too…and so would you. Also, killing pregnant teens and carrying a gun and running from the cops after breaking the law, not a recipe for avoiding being shot by the police.

    Reply
  33. Ronald

    That being said: Now it's all a distraction from whether SFPD could have apprehended him reasonably without endangering themselves or killing him…which is the only thing that should matter
    cause if he was running, back turned, and not holding the gun, their asses should fry!

    Reply
  34. Anon

    Pray tell, if John Malvo wasn’t a psycho with a gun, what was he? Or are spree killers higher up on the order of being by virtue of not having a badge?

    I’m not a fan of the police, but LaShonda seems too stupid to grasp the irony of her own post.

    Reply
  35. The Hard Truth

    What is wrong with the POC movement? I'll tell you what's wrong. We rush to the defense of ANY CREEP who gets killed by PD. Have any of you even bothered to read the story? This guy was SHOOTING indiscriminately over his shoulder as he ran because he was wanted for the MURDER of a pregnant woman. He could care less who got shot in the way. He was sentenced to 22 months in jail for trying to FORCE a 13 year old girl into prostitution after having sex with her. This is our martyr?? No wonder no one takes us seriously any more….

    Reply
  36. MikeHawk

    The police are at fault for having a better aim apparently…because as we all know, innocent people flea all of the time.

    P.S. does anyone know if he actually did have a transfer ticket, sounds like someone owe $2 to SF Muni.

    Reply
  37. Mariam

    Guilty or innocent is not the point. A young man lay in his blood and the police made sure he is as good as dead before he got attention. I hear some cruel and crass comments that make me wonder. Rules of war: you always care for the injured no matter which side they come from. The war on terror is stripping some of us of ethics and compassion. I hate to think I will grow old in a country with so many heartless people.

    Reply
    1. notintheface

      No you don't. In war you shoot them again. Not that this is a war. It shouldn't be black and white. It should be wrong and right. If the kid was unarmed, those cops should pay. If he was shooting and did what he was accused of, he got what he had comming. As far as medical attention, cops don't carry surgical equipment. And the crowd didn't make things eaiser.

      Reply
  38. Scruplewarrior!

    When are we going to stop playing the role of victim and start owning up for the savage behavior taking place in our community by OUR OWN PEOPLE! I hold bias media, such as this one, responsible for helping to "aid and abet" the ignorance running rampant in the Bayview. I grew up on 3rd and Ingerson and am truly disgusted by the disrespectful, shameful genocidal destruction at the hands of my own damn people. Where's the "outrage" for that? I've lost countless friends and two cousins-murdered NOT by the cops-but by young brothers just like that boy in the story above. Unfortunately, I have relatives who still live in Hunters Point that I visit only on VERY SPECIAL OCCASIONS and trust me–it's not the damn Police I fear when I go there!

    Reply
    1. Mellie

      Sounds like you got yourself a cause and by the positive votes, some supporters to boot!
      Go to it , Brother!
      If not you, then who else?

      Reply
  39. Ramon

    What a bunch of idiots. he wasn't shot for not paying his fare. he's a wanted felon for the murder of a pregnant19-year-old, and he just shot three teenagers in WA. he also just got out of jail for forcing a 14-year-old into prostitution, and before that he was found guilty of raping a 13-year-old. So the question is not, "How come a Black man can get shot for not having a transfer?" It's "How come a Black man can do this to three other black teenagers, and a black unborn baby and think he can get away with it?" And why do you have to make it about race anyway? They didn;t shoot him because he's black. They shot him because he's a rapist, murderer and felon with a rap sheet a mile long wanted for murder as recently as last week. Do your research, people. SFPD: Thank you for doing your job before this guy hurt or killed anyone else.

    Reply
  40. superxicana

    In Ella Baker's words, black civil rights leader, which still ring true today.

    "Until the killing of black men, black mothers' sons Is as important as
    the killing of white men, white mothers' sons.
    We who believe in freedom cannot rest
    We who believe in freedom cannot rest until it comes"

    Unfortunately not much has changed since her time.

    Reply
    1. mark

      you are the epitome of retarded. Did you read any of the comments or do any research before you commented? He had a gun. and turns out this guy is a complete scumbag.

      Reply
  41. david

    Dang, there is literally no context to this piece besides the fact that a young man is dead. Instead of using it as a reactionary piece, could you at least get some information surrounding the incident, and actually report something?

    Reply
  42. Cephus Coonson

    Another coon gets killed for a crime and the whole nigger neighborhood goes up in arms. First off, that is a 100% black neighborhood so of course no black person could EVER do any wrong. Second, whats the difference if the cops kill him or another black person. I'm sure some gang member would have killed him later in life anyway. Oh well, one less shitskin that my kids have to worry about.

    Reply
    1. Spliver

      THAT IS JUST RACIST!!!! I don't mean your comment. I mean the fact that it was black and mexican cops doing the shooting. Those guys must have hate in their hearts for the black man.

      Reply
    2. PTSD

      Coonson,

      In my experience people who use the term "nigger neighborhood" demonstrate a lack of equality in their discernment.

      Reply
  43. Mark

    Kudos to the police. They did their jobs well taking this scumbag out. Give it a few days and the rest of the story will come out and the majority of you people saying F the police will realize how foolish you have been.. I didn't really expect fair reporting considering this is a black run website and the kid happened to be black. Don't be a scumbag and you won't get shot, plain and simple.

    Reply
  44. Leslea

    well maybe I'm just naive… But a guy who is NOT currently shooting at anyone, who is a SUSPECT (aka NOT CONVICTED) in a crime and MIGHT have other criminal history, is automatically OK for the cops to shoot him multiple times in the back in what is clearly an execution? Apparently "innocent until PROVEN guilty in a COURT OF LAW" is no longer applicable in the US? Or how about the questions they needed to ask in regard to these other cases. Oh forget that, the OK Corral treatment took care of that.

    Wanted is not convicted. Suspected is not convicted. But hey, if this is OK to gun down SUSPECTS in the street, why not just form full on lynch mobs? That's OK by the logic you police excusers are using. Likewise pistols at dawn for petty BS disagreements. Forget small claims court, get the duelling pistols instead.

    Those of you excusing the EXECUTION and MURDER of this TEENAGER are disgusting. So much for respect of actual LAW. Apparently accusations of wrongdoing are enough to satisfy your vile bloodlust.

    Reply
    1. TiredoftheBS

      You're condemning the police officers involved while the investigation is still ongoing. "A little knowledge is a dangerous thing". Seeing you use the words execution means you've already made up your mind that he did not have a gun and he did not shoot at the police. Innocent until proven guilty has no barring on this situation in regards to "the suspect". It wasn't known by the officers that he was wanted for questioning nor did it have any effect on how he was treated. He ran, leading to a pursuit. Eventually, the officers felt threatened and shot at him, mortally wounding him. However, you've managed to turn a situation with hazy facts into a grandstanding speech for yourself in defense of an "innocent man". Guess what, he was guilty. Guilty of running from the police over a $2 muni fare. While it's not a crime punishable by death, it's a stupid decision that led to his death, and it was a decision that he made on his own. Soon enough it will be known whether the SFPD was unjustified, or if he was also guilty of firing his weapon at the police.
      I'll just say it, you were right, you're naive. Jumping to conclusions without all the facts is something you do when you're nine. If you want to be taken seriously when you grow up, try supporting your argument. You're writing this as if it's October 10th, 2011, the investigation is over and it was proven that he was shot in cold blood. In reality, it's July 19th, 2011 and the tests that will give light to facts of this situation have not been finished. You don't have a foot to stand on.

      Reply
    2. mark

      innocent people usually run from the cops. he didn't run because he didn't pay the $2 he most likely paid because he committed all of those crimes. Also, he DID (like my use of caps, I'm copying you) shoot at the police, and the police fired back which ended in him getting killed. I believe you could call that self-defense. Police officers aren't immortal and they fear for their lives too.. Stop trying to hate on the cops for doing their job and protecting our community.

      Reply

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